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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 1997 > Nov > Nov 27

Re: Kenneth Arnold's testimony

From: Don Ledger <dledger@istar.ca>
Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 15:35:08 +0100
Fwd Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 08:19:48 -0500
Subject: Re: Kenneth Arnold's testimony

> >From: USDSCUBA@aol.com [Gordon Scott]
> >Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 01:34:15 -0500 (EST)
> >To: updates@globalserve.net
> >Subject: Re: UFO UpDate: Re: Kenneth Arnold's testimony

> >>Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 23:27:36 -0500
> >>From: bruce maccabee <brumac@compuserve.com>
> >>Subject: UFO UpDate: Re: Kenneth Arnold's testimony

> >> A strange bird is a pelican...It flies over 100
> >>miles per hour when ever it can....especially when
> >>trying to race a small airplane while flying southward
> >>past Mt. Rainier.

> >Pretty funny stuff about the birds, however according to a close
> >friend within the military at the time the vehicle as seen by Mr
> >K. Arnold was a German made Gotha Go 229 IX being test flown for
> >radar testing. These high performance aircraft were the same
> >basic flying wing shape as described in his report, and were
> >being tested during the time period. These Go 229 were almost
> >invisible on radar due to the 17 mm plywood skin, and with twin
> >Junkers Jumo 1890 pounds of thrust turbojet engines it was also
> >quite fast. Reichsmarshal Hermann Goring was so impressed he
> >wanted to mass produce these advanced aircraft. This allied
> >information also helped Jack Northrop with his.Amercian designs.
> >The Germans also had an aircraft known as project P-12 with a ram
> j>et, (our own Air Force did the wind tunnel tests after the
> >war). Designed much like our current SR-71 replacment aircraft.

Hello Gordon and Bruce,

The Gotha was produced by the Germans for one reason, lack of
aluminum. The Germans were desparate. The fact that the Gotha was
partially invisible to radar was an accident of design, not
intentional. Don't forget radar was primitive in its infancy and
easily fooled.  The British and Allies were well aware of the
value of plywood as a material that did not reflect radar wave
propagation from discovering that their older aircraft such as
the Tiger Moth rainer, mostly fabric and wood, did not show up
well on radar and its own Mosquito interceptor/ bomber made of
steam molded plywood [made right here in Nova Scotia and Ontario
as a matter of fact] did not reflect back all of the microwaves
beamed at it.

The fact is none of these aircraft were capable of the speeds
clocked by Arnold.  The Gotha was not produced in large numbers.
If you did capture a few from the Germans when the war ended, why
in the name of heavens would you be testing them in the Cascade
Mountains and where did 9 of them come from and what is the point
of testing nine at once. and where the heck is the radar to test
against them in the mountains.

You know it seems there are a more than a few attempts at
pounding a square peg into a round hole re the Arnold sighting.
People keep coming up with solutions but to only 3 or 4 of twenty
points. None of them match up.  Everyone should be familiar with
Occum's(sp) Razor by now which states "... that all things being
equal the simplist explanation is usually the right one". Don't
you think that in the Arnold case that for once that principle
works in our favour.

> (Uh, oh. sounds like a modification of the Nazi UFO hypothesis.)
> Anyway, may I calmly suggest there were NO planes capable of
> supersonic flight (740 mph roughly) at that time.  (Chuck Yaeger
> proved he had "the right stuff" in Oct. 1947.)  Also, I would
> doubt that we had 9 flyable, plywood skin craft for "radar
> testing" flying near Mt. Rainier at the time.  Any test craft
> such as that would have been operating over military bases or
> restricted areas.

Do you know that it was years before the American's came up with
a decent ejection seat for jet aircraft let alone coming up with
sophisticated high speed tailess aircraft. I don't want to ruffle
any feathers but the US was just not a front runner in jet design
for many years and it was well into the fifties before they
caught up. We have got to stop thinking that all things were
possible after the war, that one technological wonder after the
other was being discovered there, at least in the aviation field.
It was not so.  America's strength was in her leaps in
electronics not in jet design. That was the field of the
Russian's, the British and here in Canada. If you call me on this
you are going to get miles of email about it. Don't worry, by the
sixties the US had caught up and were passing everybody but the

> >But why bother with such old news ? flying wings have been around
> >since the 1930's

Not true flying wings, without tails.

 and the rocket powered versions like the Me 163
> >B.

The thing took off [leaving its wheels behind] went straight up,
manouvered for about 4 minutes at 550 mph then came in and landed
on a belly skid. Great machine for mountain flying and still not
fast enough to match Arnold's calculated speeds.

> >Perhaps we should be more concerned with the several secret bases
> >of black triangle aircraft in Canada being flown by UN forces
> >and paid for by Amercian tax dollars, or what the CIA has been
> >purchasing for 26 Billion dollars ?

Where the hell did this one come from?

> >There seems to be plenty of strange things going on right
> >now don't you think ?

> Yes, indeed. As far as I am concerned, secret military craft are
> part of the modern-day noise. HOWEVER, the FBI was asked to
> investigate saucer sightings in 1947 and, before so doing, asked
> for assurance from the Air Force that there were no classified
> projects that could account for the early saucer sightings. The
> FBI was assured that there were no such projects in any of the
> armed forces.

Good point Bruce, but then my paranoia kicks in. I'm sure that
the US had many different exotic secret plans in the hopper, but
none of them capable of doing what Arnold saw. What was really
concerning the USAAF/USAF was that they could not eliminate the
Russians as a possible culprit for the outbreak of UFO sightings.
 If it wasn't the Russians then the alternative was a mindblower.
Occum's Razor.

Don Ledger

P.S. Check out this latest from NASA/Boeing re tailess aircraft.
Don't forget, this is 1997 technology.  Too bad they just didn't
tap into all of that German technology that's been laying around
since Arnold's time.

I snipped a great deal of it.

RELEASE:  97-276


     The NASA/Boeing X-36 Tailless Fighter Agility Research
Aircraft successfully completed its flight research program --
demonstrating the feasibility of future tailless fighters
achieving agility levels superior to today's best military fighter

     The project goals are to develop and demonstrate enhanced
technologies to improve the maneuverability and survivability of
future fighter aircraft.  "All of our project goals were met or
exceeded," said Mark Sumich, X-36 project manager at NASA's Ames
Research Center, Moffett Field, CA.

     During the final flight phase, the X-36 project team examined
the aircraft's agility at low speed/high angles of attack and at
high speed/low angles of attack.  "We also achieved the final
flight's goal to expand the X-36's speed envelope up to 206 knots
(234 miles per hour)," Sumich said.  "The aircraft's stability and
handling qualities were excellent at both ends of the speed envelope."

     Ames and the Boeing Phantom Works developed the technologies
required for a tailless fighter beginning in 1989.  In 1993, the
Phantom Works proposed the remotely piloted aircraft technology
demonstration to validate the technologies in a real flight
environment.  In 1994, Phantom Works began fabrication of the two
aircraft in its rapid prototyping facility in St. Louis.  NASA and
Boeing are full partners in the project that was jointly funded
under a roughly 50/50 cost-sharing arrangement.  The combined
program cost for the development, fabrication, and flight testing
of the two prototype aircraft is approximately $20 million.  Ames
leads the X-36 program; Dryden is hosting the program and
providing range support.


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