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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 1998 > Jul > Jul 25

UFOs, Skeptics and The Misinformed

From: Dave Ledger <dledger@cableinet. co. uk>
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1998 19:39:25 +0100
Fwd Date: Sat, 25 Jul 1998 19:49:24 -0400
Subject: UFOs, Skeptics and The Misinformed

Greetings Errol & fellow list members,

Here at UFO Scotland we keep recieving volumes of mail saying
the same thing and asking the same old questions with regard to
ufology past and present.

I thought I would forward a typical letter with its reply for
your interest and ask if this is also common ground for other
UFO website owners.

Thanks for your time

Dave Ledger.



Many thanks for your interesting mail. It certainly was thought
provoking to say the least but dare I say it, was obviously
written through the eyes of a total skeptic!.

I have never once said on my website that these UNKNOWNS were
actually aliens space ships etc. That is your own
misinterpretation my friend. Many UFO sightings could and
probably will be secret military craft etc but not all of them.

>what people are seeing are optical anomilies such as land
>lights, ball lightning and planet occultations. This seems
>ridiculous too but the human imagination is one of the most
>powerful forces of nature that we know of.

I totally agree that Ufology is followed by many who do not have
any serious direction in life or just plain gullible folks, but
there are many who research the subject objectively like myself
who are after only the truth no matter what it ends up as.

If you had researched the subject of ufology properly, you would
see that sightings etc are not a relatively new trend as you had
put it. They have been going on for thousands of years, even
depicted in cave paintings by our ancients. The problem with the
whole thing is that folks have not been properly informed and
kept in the dark about sightings for years by our own
governments. Perhaps this is because most of them are indeed
secret military prototypes etc and it is easier to let the
public think they are of an Extra terrestrial nature as opposed
to secret.

>I dont doubt that lifeforms exist elsewhere, in face I believe
>that there must be thounds if not millions of populated
>planets elsewhere in the universe

>but why would they visit us? If they did visit planet earth
>then I dont think anyone could hide it - not even the "mighty"
>US government.

Yes you are right there too but think of this. Just supposing
their really are extra terrestrial visitors visiting us from
their planets. If you were one of them and were a peaceful and
more intelligent race, would you not hide from man's barbaric
ways and just watch the progress or lack of it, whichever is the
case. If we caught an ET we would pickle it or put it on a wall
as a trophy or experiment on it or cage it. If you were a
visitor would you put yourself through that just to say HI were

>Nope I dont think people are seeing space ships or aliens at
>all. Dont you think its kinda like the medievil days when
>people thought there was dragons, goblins and sea monsters?

Remember when man said you could not fly and then the wright
brothers flew in their flimsy wooden aircraft. They said it was
impossible but only because of their own short sightedness. Some
would have said it was witch craft at one time but now it is a
way of life, taken for granted by us all. It is all a matter of
how much you can open your mind to accept the future and its
possibilities instead of standing there saying it cant be done.
Our problem is that we relate our world and our universe by our
own scientific limitations and what we believe is possible.
Science is changing all the time along with our understanding of
it making new possibilities all the time, but it is only useful
to those who are not on the black and white road so to speak.

Now take a good look through your history books and tell me that
we have always been correct with our assumptions of what we can
and cant do. You will find that most of the things that were
said to be impossible years ago are easily possible now.

>to be honest I think its more like some kind of hysteria,
>with the reports mirroring the Hollywood alien trends of
>the day.

What about all the sighting reports by civilians and military
and R.A.F. before all the hollywood hype. If you research the
subject thoroughly, you will see that there is a lot more to
ufology than meets the eye. Some of the best reports come from
the 40s and 50s. I do agree however that there is a lot more
chance of sightings today being hoaxed but not them all.

I strongly suggest that you visit the website again and view the
worlds best UFO video footage page. Then come back and tell me
that all of these STRUCTURED craft are just dragons and goblins.
They are there and they are real and have been spotted by
millions around the world and even captured on camera. I dont
think that you will be able to explain away all of this footage
with goblins and fairies.

Let me put it another way for you. I'll bet you have never been
to Hong Kong or even seen it for real but you would swear that
it is there!

>anyway thats my thoughts on the matter
>its just that id hate to see people wasting too much time on a
>phenomenon that will never be resolved.
>what will people be seeing 2 or 3 hundred years from now?

Again that is your opinion my friend and it is not a waste of
time in my opinion. I am not afraid to ask questions or question
what we do not know about. I was like you 2 years ago, pretty
skeptical, but when you have a sighting that is multi-witness
and then the authorities say there was nothing there belonging
to them what are you supposed to think. My father was all his
life in the RAF and I am well accustomed to seeing aircraft
landing lights and navigation lights. These objects we spotted
were definately not aircraft and definately not natural light
phenomenons etc. Isn't it funny that as soon as we see something
that we cannot explain it has to become natural earth lights or
suchlike but these are not any more believable than the UFO's
themselves as Earth Light Phenomena has yet to be fully
explained also.

Finally as a last thought, I think you should look into the
Governments past involvement with UFOs. If there was nothing to
it as most seem to think, do you think the military and
airforces of the world would have put so much money and man
hours into something which was laughable at the least. I dont
think so. Try looking up documents on Project SIGN, Project
GRUDGE, Project BLUE BOOK etc. You will be suprised.

There are many reasons as to why the Governments of the world
would choose to cover up any contact from other worlds but that
is another discussion. In my opinion, there is a lot of evidence
to suggest that there is something to ufology and I do not
believe that it will always remain a secret for years to come.
We have to be ready first as a race and that may well come in my
life time and yours.

I thank you for your interesting view point and would like to
hear from you again in the future to discuss this further if you
like. Also try to get a look at the NASA shuttle missions:
STS-48 and STS-80. Fairies and Dragons? In Space? Definately
not Earth lights or Planets so perhaps you could tell me what
the anomalous objects in the video clips are.

http://wkweb5. cableinet. co. uk/dledger/video. htm

Take care of you and yours amigo, from your good

If you see someone without a smile.... give them one of yours :)
Posted by: Dave Ledger UFOSCOT@cableinet. co. uk
Visit "UFO SCOTLAND" at:
http://wkweb5. cableinet. co. uk/dledger/index. htm
Reach us on ICQ #4851425
Scotland Director for UFO Sky Searchers International.
Visit UFOSSI at http://www. UFOssi. org/index. htm

C1717>>He did? Did you know Meier once lived in a farm house with >sections having dirt floors when he took many of those pictures? >If he did not have the money to repair his farm house, where he >found the money to fake pictures and create a movie? That's American folklore! Yes, Meier lived on a farm and yes, Meier wasn't rich, but one could argue since he came up with his pics this all changed! Also it's not that expensive to come up with convincing fakes, not in those years, not in Switserland! >>This behaviour can be interpreted as sectarian, cult-like >>behaviour only! Also we did a new analysis of a couple of >>Meier-pics ALSO found on their website.(Just so the good ol' >>MIB-excuse won't work this time ;-)) What we obviously noted was >>the following: >>And if that all isn't enough, Meier still trying to manipulate >>the minds of his somewhat naive followers. >If Meier's group is cult-like, do assume the world we live in to >be a larger cult? Please understand, many beliefs in society are >cult-like! Remember, the debunking clique you're with, is also a >cult -- This I think, shows how little you know about me OR my ideas about UFOs! First of all: I'm not in a debunking-clique. My opinion however is based on a strong suspicion and the evidence there is so far, and not on simple believe! But since you don't know me how can you make a statement like that anyway! >like-minded working together. Don't reverve the word >"cult" as a negative, similar to how many have reserved the word >"holocaust" for the Jews. If you don't agree with Meier for >whatever reason, that is your right, but don't go about making >decisions for the masses. If others come into Meier's teachings, >and for whatever reason disapproved, that's their right, and >they have the freewill to stop. Meier does not run a secret >society where mysterious pacts are signed, and members ascend in >degrees. Where did I make decisions for others? I heard other stories from ex-FIGU members! Even as we speak Meier is publicly bashing the name of his own ex-wife! I think that says it all... >Many of society's doctrine and actions, brainwashes us or > conditions us from childhood into adulthood with a set of > beliefs often filled with wrong and selfish thinking. That's one >of the reasons why the world is subdued in such madness. The > knowledge you and I have, did not fall from the sky. Over time, >we will all evolve into what is the truth, and the likes of you, >I and Meier will have faded away. >>Picture 200: Made taken March 8, 1976 >>After we enhanced the image we noted that the pixels in the > >background were defiantly different from those on the > >craft...rather sloppy work I'd say...but after we decided to > >erase the back-ground we ALSO noticed a white edge, clearly a > >result of "cut and paste"! >Did you deduce your findings from a firsthand scan, or from the >degraded pixelated .jpg artifact copy? The pictures we used we got from FiGU and you can also find them on their home-page Also i'd like to state that difference in pixels and other obvious hoaxes can be determined on second or third generation pics! >>This time a MIB tried to shoot him from close range. To prove >>this Meier came up with a .22 bullet stuck in a tree. Of course >>Meier had no other witnesses of this "attack". In my opinion >>those MIB in question must've been terrible rookies or drunk, if >>they weren't capable of hitting him at an 8 meter distance! >So you believe Meier's recent assassination attempt was a hoax? >Re-read the contact info again. Meier said the MIB were behind >it. ...Ah, if it were the MiB A) Why didn't he hit Meier? B) Why would he have used a .22? Seems like a lousy organization to me like this... >>I guess it's useless wasting anymore time on Meier and his cult, >>although I feel sorry for his followers who need to believe in >>something... > >If Meier's followers believe in something, does that mean you >believe in nothing? If that's the case, how did you arrived at >your conclusions? Did Korff convince you that the Meier case is >a hoax? Lemme ask ya one back before answering: "Are you a FiGU-Member?" I believe in sunshine, smiles, a good song even UFOs, but not if it can be proven to be a hoax or whatever, to my opinion that's what happend in the Meier case. Don't fear :) Korff has nothing to do with this, NOT AT ALL, even though he promised interesting data of his own research to add to this, he has failed to do so. With Kind Regards, Andy Denne Abduction & UFO Research Association Nijmegen The Netherlands