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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 1998 > Jun > Jun 15

Re: Occam's Razor and UFOs

From: John Rimmer <johnr@magonia.demon.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 00:44:55 +0100
Fwd Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 21:41:48 -0400
Subject: Re: Occam's Razor and UFOs

>From: Jean-Luc Rivera <PSaintc798@aol.com>
>Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 12:42:20 EDT
>To: updates@globalserve.net
>Subject: Re:  UFO UpDate: Re: Occam's Razor and UFOs

>>From: "Greg Sandow" <gsandow@prodigy.net>
>>To: "'UFO UpDates - Toronto'" <updates@globalserve.net>
>>Subject: RE: UFO UpDate: Re: Occam's Razor and UFOs
>>Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 18:45:41 -0400

I see that Greg Sandow points out elsewhere that this original
posting is by me (John Rimmer) rather than him. I will take this
opportunity to reply to Jean-Luc Rivera's points.

>>If the PH is valid it implies that the UFO is most widespread in
>>countries which share social and economic conditions, and have
>>similar cultural values. As the UFO phenomenon seems most
>>widespread in the USA we would expect it to be experienced most
>>often in similar societies. This does seem to be the case. The
>>countries with the greatest number of UFO reports, and public
>>interest in ufology, besides the USA are either those which
>>share its cultural and social background, e.g. the UK, Western
>>Europe, Canada; or those which have wide exposure to US cultural
>>and social values, e.g. Central and South America (and no,
>>Jerry, this isn't some sort of Ameriphobia, I actually quite
>>*like* most American social and cultural values).

>>We would expect the UFO phenomena to be least widespread in
>>those societies which either do not share this social
>>background, or are actually hostile to it, e.g. the Islamic
>>countries, most of Africa, Asia (except Japan), and this is
>>indeed the case. This is not, of course, to say that no UFO
>>reports at all come from those countries.

>We don't know how widespread the UFO phenomenon is in these
>parts of the world: the lack of investigators or just of
>channels to receive the reports maybe the reason of the absence
>or quasi-absence. In Malaysia, thanks to the work of Ahmad
>Jamaludin, we have learned of the existence of UFO waves which
>would have gone unreported otherwise.

Even in Western Countries the presence of one active investigator
can skew reporting figures. Even after all these years it is
still unclear just how much of the Warminster phenomenon was
reporting of objectively real phenomena (possibly Army activity)
and how much was created by the atmosphere produced by Arthur
Shuttlewood and his cohorts.

>Furthermore the works of Bertrand Meheust (in Algeria and Gabon)
>and Thierry Pinvidic (in Algeria) published in France show that
>the UFO phenomenon exists in different cultures and apparently
>awaits to be reported. These 2 french researchers cannot be
>suspected of deep ETH bias in their investigations as the list
>members not familiar with french ufology must know that they are
>supporters of the PH.

I am certainly aware of this work. We have published a summary of
Pinvidic's Algerian work in Magonia in the 1980's. Pinvidic has
certainly shown that UFO activity *exists* in Algeria, I would
never doubt this, but he also demonstrates how untypical it is of
UFO activity in Europe.


>>We are beginning to see more reports and film from the
>>Czech Republic for example, and elsewhere. And this is not
>>simply a factor of the freeing of press and other media in those
>>countries - even in the Communist era there seemed to be no
>>serious block to reports coming out of Eastern Europe. In the
>>Communist era the Eastern European country which seemed to have
>>the most UFO reports was Romania, which at the time was seen as
>>breaking from the Soviet Bloc.

>If you really believe that, please read Boris Shurinov history
>of the UFO movement in the former USSR. Don't you remember also
>how at one point only Juri Lina was able to translate for the
>FSR some UFO samizdats smuggled out of the country. You are
>right only for Romania with Ion Hobana.

As I say elsewhere, I may have over-emphasised the differences
between Eastern and Western bloc approaches to the UFO phenomenon
and underestimated the degree of Western cultural influence in
the Soviet Bloc even during the Cold War era. We meed further
research on this.


>>I'll tell you what would disprove the Psychosocial Hypothesis: a
>>decent sized UFO wave, with abductions, in North Africa or the
>>Middle East, within the next few years. When that happens I'll
>>>start watching the skies!

>Do you really think that if there was a wave of " alien
>abductions " in Ahghanistan or in some middle eastern or african
>country torn by war and closed to foreigners we would hear about

Why Afghanistan or war-torn countries? Why not India (pretty
democratic, reasonably free press) or Tunisia (very open to
foreigners), or Taiwan or South Korea (good communications)?

John Rimmer
Magonia Online, a member of the P.L.A.Driftwood Organisation

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