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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 1999 > Apr > Apr 3

Re: Friedman vs. Krauss Debate

From: Bruce Maccabee <brumac@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 00:14:29 -0500
Fwd Date: Sat, 03 Apr 1999 01:33:29 -0500
Subject: Re: Friedman vs. Krauss Debate

>Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 17:36:57 +0100
>To: UFO UpDates - Toronto <updates@globalserve.net>
>From: John Rimmer <magonia@magonia.demon.co.uk>
>Subject: Re: Friedman vs. Krauss Debate


>I know it's a hopeless question, and Serge Salvaille has
>specifically ruled himself out from answering it, but I'll try
>again: can we have a list of the ten UFO cases giving the best
>evidence for an extraterrestrial origin for the UFO phenomenon?.

>I won't hold my breath.

It's not a hopeless question.... but it apparently hopeless to
get any agreement. It seems to me we've been along this route
before on this mail list. Arguments over individual cases seem
to degenerate into name calling.

The _first_ step is to determine whether or not there are any
for which there is general agreement that they are _unexplained_
by conventional phenomena. _Then_ we can try to decide what they
may represent. (Mind you, the deep skeptics/debunkers reject the
idea that any case cannot be explained. Ex: PJK's famous
statement that there is no case for which he hasn't been able to
find a "prosaic explanation." Whether said explanation mamkes
any sense or not seems to be irrelevant.  Ex. one of the New
Zealand sightings of Dec 31, 1978, involves color movie film of
a light flashing bright white to a dimmer triangular arrangement
of red and orange lights. PJK asserts that the prosaic
explanation is that the cameraman filmed a red flashing light on
top of the aircraft from _inside_ the aircraft by filming the
reflection off a rotating propellor. Optical Physics proves that
film of the flashing red light could not create pure white
overexposed images. This proof was carefully explained to Friend
Phil over many months of discussion.... but that didn't stop him
from publishing this "prosaic explanation" in his book  "UFOs,
The Public Deceived".... in which he deceived the public!)

So anyway, you want ten?

Try these.

Feb. 28, 1904
(USS Supply sighting of three "remarkable meteors"
Yes, I know this "violently contradicts" the recent analysis
of Barry Greenwood..... but I think he is wrong!)

June 24, 1947
KENNETH ARNOLD (NOT geese or pelicans or the most recent,

June 24, 1947
FRED JOHNSON (first unexplained sightings in the BB file, where
Arnold's sighting has a "prosaic explanation":  mirage)

April 24, 1949

May 24, 1949
ROGUE IVER, OREGON (Case 10 of Special Report#14)

April 27, 1950
WHITE SANDS MOVIE FILM (of high speed objects
at 150,000 ft, 30 ft in diameter traveling over
White Sands test area after a rocket launch; height
and size determined by triangulation)

May 11, 1950
McMINNVILLE, OREGON (Trent photo case;
Trent's died couple years ago, without
July 2, 1952

TRINDADE ISLAND (Baruna photos)
April 24, 1964

SOCORRO, NM (Zamorra sighting)
Sept. 13, 1966

GEMINI 11 in orbit (photos unidentified)
Sept. 19, 1975

TEHRAN, IRAN (Iranian jet case)
December 31, 1978

NEW ZEALAND SIGHTI NGS (multiple witness,
Air Traffic control tape, reporter's tape, 16 mm
color movie film; some of the best documented
radar/visual/photographic sightings ever)

August 9, 1980
KIRTLAND AFB (landed UFO sighting by Sandia
Security Guard)

December 2, 1981
COLUMBIA, CT (multiple witness, photographs)
(probably no one ever hear about this one....
only published in FATE mag,._)

November 14, 1986
("prosaic explanation #1:  Mars and Jupiter
"posaic explanation #2" [when #1 obviously failed]:
moonlight reflecting from clouds)

November 1987 - July 1988
(even without Ed this was a major flap)

January 8, 1990
with multiple photographers including Ed Walters

September 16, 1992
GULF BREEZE SIGHTING of a Ring of Lights by ME
and about 30 others/video/audio/triangulation

March 8, 1995
GRENOBLE, FRANCE (high speed object
tracked by Swiss military radar traveling at
nearly MACH 3 in French Air Space; object
descended at high speed and disappeared;
first reported in new book by Illobrand von

July 2, 1998
TICONDEROGA, NY (video; see MUFON Journal
Jan 1999)


More than ten.

And definitely biased toward those cases which I have worked on.

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