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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 1999 > Jan > Jan 18

Re: Abductions: Return to the Herd

From: Leanne Martin <leanne_martin@hotmail.com>
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 03:53:49 PST
Fwd Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 12:07:07 -0500
Subject: Re: Abductions: Return to the Herd

>Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 14:09:11 -0600
>To: <leanne_martin@hotmail.com>
>From: Michael Christol <mchristo@mindspring.com>
>Subject: Re: Abductions: Return to the Herd

>>At 09:33 AM 12/23/98 -0500, you wrote:
>>From: "Leanne Martin" <leanne_martin@hotmail.com>
>>To: updates@globalserve.net
>>Subject: Re: Abductions: Return to the Herd
>>Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1998 14:32:36 PST

>>>If we can accept the idea that
>>>Humanity may have indeed been engineered by "space faring
>>>scientists," many million years ago, then it would seem logical
>>A very long bow to draw . . . and not a skeric of proof (funny about

Bilge actually . . . <g>  (yes I'm back from holidays!!!)
>Just out of curiousity, how do you explain the beginnings of
>human beings?
Try reading the "origin of the species" . . .
>>>If the doctors, neurosurgeons, etc., can't explain what has
>>>happened to this man, how then can I?
>>"It is 'unexplainable' therefore aliens did it"?
>It is what this man says happened to him...does it make it
>so?  No...is he saying it to be important?  I can't answer
>that.  He is a millionaire, so I don't think he is doing
>if for money...in fact, I know that he is not...
>He has not published a book...he is not on a lecture tour,
>he simply talks to those whom he comes in contact with,
>and tells his story.
>He did not loose all memory of the happening.  Yet, he did
>not remember all of it either.  He tells me that bits and
>pieces of new material materialize in his Consciousness
>from time to time and he is frustrated, knowing there is
>so much more that he cannot remember.
>He has the normal "scoup" marks on his calfs, to go along
>with his total lack of sensory feeling...
>His is an interesting case, to me.  Very interesting...

Even the very rich suffer delusions . . . (if they're poor
they're insane but if they're rich then they're eccentric!)

>>>For them yes...I would agree...to me as an observer, I don't
>>>know...even though I do accept the hypothisis that these events
>>>do take place...

>>Did you accept only on verbal evidence?

>If you had been reading the material I was posting to you,
>you would have seen that I did not...remember??? <g>

>>>I can show you the man, in this instance, if you care to travel
>>>here to see and test him for yourself....He has entertained
>>>other investigators, hypnotists, & Medical Students which I have
>>>brought to him...

>>"A man with odd symptoms equals proof of alien abduction"?

>Nor does it disprove alien abduction...

It also doesn't disprove that he was the subject of a wierd
military experiment, or had a witch/warlock cast a nasty spell
on him, or even (heaven forbid) is experiencing a valid if
extremely peculiar medical condition . . .

>This is an ify situation...are you being steadfast simply to
>support your ideology regarding abductions, or because you cannot
>accept the idea that this person may have had such an experience???

I still expect researchers to show verifiable proof of such
claims of 'alien causality'.

>>>>"I know in my heart and soul that the earth is flat and that if
>>>>I sail too far in any one direction I will eventually fall into
>>>>space. I know this is true and you better belief me or you are a
>>>>sad, bad person!"

>>>Ha, ha, ha...very good...but, unfortunately, I have "flown over
>>>the horizon," to such places as Hawaii and France...I did not
>>>fly off into space, nor fall into an abyss. <g> Just call me a
>>>mean old person...<g>

>>No I shan't, just awee bit short on the science.

>So, I am a bit short on science, if I don't accept the idea that
>the earth is flat???  Hmmm...interesting statment.
>Especially since I have verifiable date, taken from satellite
>information as well as Shuttle Astronaut research accquired while
>orbiting this "flat earth" which disproves equivically the "flat
>earth" idea...it proves emphatically that the earth is a "sphere."
>Not perfectly round, mind you, but flat at the poles and bulging
>at the equator...  Ha, ha, ha...I like your wit...Leanne...

No, but you obviously have a problem understanding what an
analogy is.

>>>quasi-religious??? By what standards and judgements do you
>>>determine a thing to be quasi-anything??? You sound so much like
>>>a Fruedian, while I prefer Carl Jung. <g> You may be a dedicated
>>>religious person, for all I know.

I am dedicatedly sacreligious <g>

>>A belief in something as fact without a shred of hard evidence
>>qualifies in my book!

>Such a short answer to such a complex paragraph...In essesence,
>you just did not answer my questions...
>What is the name of the "book" you wrote?  Maybe I should read it.<G>

>>>There have been many people tested by psychologists and medical


>>>forty years or so.

>>Just because a specialist works on something it doesn't mean that
>>any claimed outcomes are scintifically accurate. All results must
>>be 'verifiable by peer review'. (When I get back from my holiday I
>>shall endeavour to track down those of whom you speak and see their

Could you please supply me some web links?

>>You know, of course, that you can have a chip inserted into
>>your dog, should you have one, but does that make one an alien
>>abductor for doing so?

>If a specialist's work is not vindication of a science, then there
>is no vendification...by using this point of presumption, then there
>is no way to "verify" anything...
>Yes, I do know that there are chips for "tracking" pets....how much
>of a Jump is it to inject the same chip into a human?

A very short jump but it does not prove that aliens put a chip
in anyone . . . (Was there a true chip implanted in anyone?)

>From these two Accademic Researchers, you will find links to others,
>with whom they have shared their research efforts and from whom they
>have received information as well.
>Hopefully, your efforts to "track down those of whom you speek"
>will add insight to your search for verifiable proof/facts in regards
>to the entire phenomena....<smile>  But, there are no absolutes! <g>

>>>You are assuming much here...

>>You bet, but it was obviously an illustrative example. Religious
>>indoctrination works the same way.

>I don't disagree.  But why do you equate all of this with
>Religon?  <snip>

Because too many people are taking up this theme with a
religious fervor that would do any of the old inquisitors proud.
To wit, the amount of damning aimed at me for requesting,
rightly, that all of the 'abductee' researchers need to find
hard evidence (i.e. not the word-of-mouth kind) and place it on
the table for credible peer review.

>>I agree, but it only points out the obvious - Tesla's facts were
>>mostly verifiable else he would not have proved his worth for the
>>patents he chieved in securing. His other theories on faster than
>>light transmission are yet to be proven but should they be proven
>>then he will get the recognition for that as well.

>I hope your faith in this system is warrented.  I do not feel Tesla
>will ever be recognized Publicly by the establised sciences.  He
>made them look so foolish so many times back then...to recant and
>uphold him today would be an admission that they were wrong back
>then...I don't see them making such an admission...it would cast
>doubt on many of their other pronouncements and laws...<G>

>>It is, however, not a good analogy for the proof of alien abductions
>>only of human ineptitude, pride and greed.

>No, maybe not, but it shows how our system handles any information
>which is not good for them...
>Yet, Tesla claimed that he received information for "The boys from
>Topside," which according to historians in UFOlogy and the Tesla
>Society, indicates he believed there was "life" on Mars and several
>of the other planets in this solar system, and he alleged receiving
>telepathic information about some of his patents and inventions
>from this source.
>He never wrote his inventions down on papter, he created them all in
>his head and transferred them to physical creations.  He was to
>science what Mozart was to music...


>>>attacks by Iraq....even though the Isrealy (sp) troops wore
>>>theirs... Thus, there were large numbers of American Soldiers
>>>who died and possibly continue to die today as a result of this.
>>>This is not my belief, it is documented. I have the radio talk
>>>show from New York, from one of the doctors who told the story
>>>and they also talked to the Dr. in Texas who made the discovery.

>>Still, this no proof for alien abductions, only of poor troop
>>management practices . . .

>Yes, and it also shows that the American Government used it's
>troops for experimentation...they were expecting larege numbers
>of casualties, and there were very few...most of them caused
>by "friendly fire."  Should I make the jump here and say that
>they "produced the numbers?"  or should we say this is just
>"poor troop management practices...?"
>Had there been large numbers of casualties, they could have
>studied the effects of the "germ or biological" warefare on
>the troops in secret, without anyone every being any wiser,
>but since there were few troops dying, they came home and became
>ill over a period of time.  Then the Government turned it's
>back on them and said it was "PTSS."  Forgive me for talking
>about this, but it says something about those who are elected
>to protect the American People...Aren't these the same people
>who are saying "there are no UFOs?"  and "there are no alien
>abductions?"  Hmmmmm.....

Well, when you've got troops that are excess to requirements . . .

Leanne  ];-)

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