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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 1999 > Jan > Jan 30

Re: Abduction - The Issue Of Reality

From: Peter Brookesmith Mendoza <DarkSecretPB@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 30 Jan 1999 19:19:32 -0500
Fwd Date: Sat, 30 Jan 1999 20:23:29 -0500
Subject: Re: Abduction - The Issue Of Reality

With the compliments of the Duke of Mendoza:

>Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1999 14:18:31 -0800 (PST)
>From: Rebecca Keith <xiannekei@yahoo.com>
>Subject: Re: Abduction - The Issue Of Reality
>To: UFO UpDates - Toronto <updates@globalserve.net>

Rebecca (hi sunbeam!) quoted Greg--

>>From: Greg Sandow <gsandow@prodigy.net>
>>To: UFO UpDates - Toronto <updates@globalserve.net>
>>Subject: Re: 1999 UFO Alien Abduction Conference Announced
>>Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1999 10:43:26 -0500

>>But typically abduction skeptics don't even mention the full
>>range of possible abduction evidence -- for instance, the claim
>>made by some abduction investigators that abductees corroborate
>>even tiny unpublished details in each others' reports.

and asked

>I'm just guessing here, but perhaps Brookesmith mentions
>something similar in his abduction book? Doesn't he interview
>Betty Hill who says something about abductees getting together
>at group meeting and comparing notes?

This is certainly in the Fortean Times version of my evening
with Betty. The interview is available on the FT website. I
can't remember if it's in the book.

In a post wirtten so long ago I cannot quote it, Greg implicitly
took me to task for not following up or mentioning some of these
"tiny unpublished details" in my book ("Alien Abductions",
Barnes & Noble (USA), Blandford (UK), ISBN 0-7607-0764-2). The
details, specifically, that he had mentioned concerned David
Jacobs's claim that abductees would describe "alien equipment"
in extreme detail, that the accounts were corroborated by
individuals unknown to each other, and that the descriptions
were so precise and consistent that Jacobs could tell what the
kit would be used for (according to the abductees) shortly after
the third or fourth account was launched. (If you follow me.)

Rather than turn that into a public and easily misconstrued
spat--and to avoid the histrionics we can both indulge in a
public forum--I explained to Greg on the phone that he'd come up
with this about three weeks before the book script was due for
delivery, and there wasn't time to write it up, let alone make
the proper enquiries to give a decent account of the claim.
Which he understood, being a scarred old hack like yrs trly and
a gent besides.

I might as well say there was an awful lot of stuff I _had_
researched that didn't get in the book either, simply for lack
of space, let alone time. A whole chapter, not to say another
book, could have been written on memory, and it would have
included Rebecca's factitious memory "implanted" (ho ho) by a
certain well-known abduction researcher, and its details. (Ed
Bullard is working on a major treatment of memory in this
connection, and whichever way his opinion falls his paper will
be a gem and his research comprehensive, so I don't feel too
much was lost!)

Among the things I would want to know or see before feeling able
to evaluate these claims fairly and justly would be: (a) a great
deal about what happens in Jacobs' support groups, _if_ he runs
any, (b) full transcripts of all the subjects' hypnotic sessions
and pre-hypnotic discussions with the investigator (c) even more
than I already know about terrestrial medical procedures (d) the
subjects' entire medical history and (e) their knowledge or
interest in (c).

One recalls Sandy Larsen's transmutation of a medical procedure
(sinus cleansing, I vaguely recall, corrections welcome) and its
incorporation into her abduction story. Just take that as a

The other "tiny unpublished detail" of which I know anything,
and have seen an example or two, is the "alien script" recorded
by Budd Hopkins. Greg, John Powell, John Velez and others
including yrs trly discussed ways of researching their
authenticity at length about two years ago on this list, but
that may have been before it was archived on the Web. I gather
Prof Stuart Appelle is doing something about these, but whether
he's taken up any of the ideas we kicked around I don't know.
But the reasonable demand was made of me that I didn't reproduce
any of this "alien writing", as that could mess up later data,
and I was happy to go along with that.

Anyway--all this is a long-winded way of saying that these
"details" haven't been discussed by skeptics, and by this one in
particular, for practical reasons rather than lack of scruple or
inability to cope with the shocking implications, de da. As John
Rimmer points out in another post, most people even inside
abductology don't know what these "details" are except in the
most general terms.

best wishes
Peritonitis D. Mallificarum
Banging Away

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