UFO UpDates
A mailing list for the study of UFO-related phenomena
'Its All Here In Black & White'
Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 2005 > May > May 25

Re: British National Archives UFO Research Guide -

From: Andy Roberts <andy.nul>
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 18:26:16 +0100
Fwd Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:32:37 -0400
Subject: Re: British National Archives UFO Research Guide -

[Non-Subscriber Post]


Neither Dave Clarke nor I post to UpDates but Nick Pope's recent
posting cannot be allowed to pass unremarked.

>From: Nick Pope <nick.nul>
>To: <ufoupdates.nul>
>Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 01:21:16 +0100
>Subject: Re: British National Archives UFO Research Guide

>>From: Joe McGonagle <joe.mcgonagle.nul>
>>To: <ufoupdates.nul>
>>Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 23:53:26 +0100
>>Subject: Re: British National Archives UFO Research Guide

>Georgina Bruni obtained them in 2001, but I don't know precisely
>when. She learned of their existence through unrelated research
>into the Cold War. I didn't find out that she had the papers
>until later.

>>I further note that you have pointedly avoided mentioning the
>>work of Clarke and Roberts by name in respect to the discovery
>>of the document. Are you willing to correct that situation now?

>Clarke and Roberts were sent the documents by the MOD, as were
>numerous other ufologists and journalists. They published
>extracts in their book in May 2002, but UFO Magazine had
>published the documents in full, a month earlier, together with
>a detailed analysis written by Georgina Bruni and myself. This
>scoop was seen (incorrectly) as a deliberate spoiler, and led to
>some furious abuse from certain quarters.

This is a blatant and conscious manipulation of the facts. To
call Pope and Bruni's pliagarism a 'scoop' is really beyond the
pale and as an exercise in intellectual self aggrandisment it's
at number 11 on the scale!

Listers can easily check the truth of the matter by referring to
the UpDates Archive.

We did _not_ publish them first in May 2002 - we published them
on 21 October 2001 in an exclusive story in The Observer, posted




Therefore, how could UFO magazine have published extracts first
in April 2002?

It is also a blatant lie that "numerous other ufologists and
journalists" were sent the documents at the same time as we
were. We obtained the documents first in May 2001 and we
challenge Nick to provide documentary evidence that anyone -
UFOlogist or journalist - obtained a copy before the date we
published them.

Georgina Bruni learned about the existence of the documents on
21 October 2001 from the Observer and UFO UpDates, and
subsequently wrote to the Ministry asking for copies. Were it
not for our research, the Observer scoop and our listing of the
file details on our website Pope and Bruni would still not have
a clue the documents existed. Indeed when we interviewed Pope on
26 February 2002 he - despite working as a clerk on the UFO desk
- claimed he had no knowledge of this important part of
ufological history, or of its whereabouts.

What actually happened is that Pope and Bruni were so peeved
that we knew about the secret British MoD files and they didn't
(despite having worked for them!) that he and Georgina then
decided to plagiarise our discovery and pointedly remove any
mention of our role in finding these documents.

Which makes Pope's claim, in relation to the TNA UFO guide,
very ironic indeed:

>I make no accusation of plagiarism, because all material on my
>website may be freely used, for non-commercial purposes,
>provided the source is quoted and it's not taken out of context.

Why is it then that Pope is not prepared to acknowledge the
original source of the Flying Saucer Working Party documents?

How can someone who works for the MoD and claims to be reporting
objectively on this subject continue to maintain this blatant

The fact remains that if we had not discovered these documents -
after two years of hard work - they would in all probability
still be sitting gathering dust in the Ministry archives.

No doubt the Pope spin-machine will come up with some
justifciation for lies and plagiarism but the facts remain.

Isn't it about time Pope grasped the nettle and gave credit
where it is due, and stopped telling such blatant lies. If this
type of wilful lying is indicative of his other research we
suggest that readers arm themselves with several bags of salt
and a finely tuned BS detector, because his latest farrago of
nonsense is the biggest pile of Papal Bull yet!

Andy Roberts & Dave Clarke

[ Next Message | Previous Message | This Day's Messages ]
This Month's Index |

UFO UpDates Main Index

UFO UpDates - Toronto - Operated by Errol Bruce-Knapp

Archive programming by Glenn Campbell at Glenn-Campbell.com