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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 2012 > Jun > Jun 24

Re: Alien Autopsy And Philip Mantle

From: Edward Gehrman <egehrman.nul>
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2012 15:42:00 -0700
Archived: Sun, 24 Jun 2012 07:44:18 -0400
Subject: Re: Alien Autopsy And Philip Mantle

>From: Kevin Randle <KRandle993.nul>
>To: post.nul
>Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 16:59:18 -0400 (EDT)
>Subject: Re: Alien Autopsy And Philip Mantle

>>From: Edward Gehrman <egehrman.nul>
>>To: <post.nul>
>>Date: Wed, 30 May 2012 09:10:44 -0700
>>Subject: Re: Alien Autopsy And Philip Mantle

>>Kevin, EBK, List,

>>Philip and I are friends, but he's mistaken about the AA.

>>The UFO community has missed a great chance to understand the
>>UFO phenomenon by studying the AA and discussing the
>>implications of the footage.

>>Only a few researchers have viewed the uncut footage or tried to
>>figure out the significance of the Socorro crash site.

>>Everyone refuses to listen to Dr Leir and his insistence that
>>the footage is of a real creature.

>>How and why did John Humphrey, a left hander, play the part of a
>>right handed surgeon and why did he and Spyros show the brain
>>being removed from the rear when it was obviously removed from
>>the front?

>>These types of mistakes are ingored or overlooked in Philip's
>>research and by the vast majority of other UFO researchers.

>>And how did Ray Santilli describe and give directions to
>>a dry lake with burned vegetation and rocks, covered with a
>>strange blue melted material, eventually identified as
>>cristobalite? He has never been to Socorro.
>>These are only a few of the unanswered questions.

>>I think it's time for folks to take another look at the uncut
>>footage and the evidence that it is hoaxed. There are many dead
>>ends in Ufology, but the AA isn't one of them.

>>Ed, List, All

>>Let's see, Ray Santilli said that the "tent" autopsy footage
>>was either faked by his friends as a joke or an attempted
>>recreation of the footage because the original was too muddy,
>>dirty, or dark to be aired. Which version do you believe and
>>don't both of them lead to the single conclusion that it is

>>If there was original tent footage, as suggested by Santilli,
>>that film, although useless for broadcast would have forensic
>>value but none of it has ever been submitted for testing which
>>leads to a single conclusion of fake.

>>We learn, now, that the hospital footage was also staged... but
>>wait, a few frames of the real autopsy were cut into the
>>admittedly fake autopsy. We just have to figure out which parts
>>are faked and which are real. Santilli says that there were only
>>about four minutes of footage that was useful so he faked the

>>In the tent debris footage, one of the I-beams has the word
>>"video" on it... and there is a Greek word for freedom on it.
>>What are the odds that alien writing would produce two
>>terrestrial words?

>>The first cameraman statement was filled with British terms and
>>when that was pointed out it was changed. Bob Shell claimed that
>>he had retyped the transcript to remove the offending British
>>words (which is not to suggest the British are offensive, only
>>that the terminology used was not that an American would use)
>>without benefit of hearing the tape. Bob Shell is currently in
>>prison for an unrelated matter, but that does not speak well of
>>his credibility.

Kevin, List,

I sent Bob Shell our exchange of posts on Updates regarding the
Alien Autopsy and asked him if he'd like to comment on them.
Below is his reply:


Kevin, Ed, List,

Dr. Leir is not the only medical professional to weigh in on
the film. Mike Hesemann showed the film to over 300 pathologists
at a pathology conference in Europe and the majority thought it
was a real body. Additionally I was in contact with a thoracic
surgeon in Massachusetts who studied the film in detail and was
also convinced that it was a real body. I'm not a medical doctor,
but trained as a zoologist and I took all of the photos for an
anatomy and physiology lab manual used in medical schools. This
involved many dissections. I've seen autopsies. I know what a
body looks like on the inside, and this looks very real.

I am convinced that the person who gave me detailed directions from
Socorro to the crash site was someone intimately familiar with the
area. As noted, Santilli is not, and has never been there.

When I went out to Socorro and drove up to Magdalena and the Plains
of St. Augustin I met and talked to many older locals, most of whom
remembered a big to-do back in 1947 about a mysterious crash out on
the Plains in an area of dry lake beds. It is not coincidental
that this is the same area where Barney Barnett reported his crash.
Unfortunately, I don't have access to my notes right now and can't
go into more detail.

Ray told me that the film was all in good condition when
the cameraman first showed it to him at his house in Florida.
After a long delay, he finally worked out a purchase price and
received the film. At that time he discovered that it had been
seriously water damaged in the interim, and that only a small
percentage of the footage was recoverable. Ray consulted with me
on how to preserve/restore water damaged footage, and, in turn, I
consulted with experts at the Eastman Kodak's motion picture
division in Colorado and got information on how to deal with such

Unfortunately, there is no sure way to restore such water damaged
film. It is my understanding from Ray that he then had as much of
the footage as possible copied frame by frame onto video. There
is nothing about any of this which raises any red flags to me.
I've come across exactly the same situation several times before,
and it is sad that often not much can be recovered.

I don't know what percentage of the final product is the original
footage. Maybe all of it is, maybe only some of it is. I don't
know if Ray was pressured into claiming he faked it. There is much
more that I don't know than there is that I do know. I do believe,
however, that there is or was original film. I do not believe that
Spyros Melaris had anything to do with the AA film.

In the tent debris footage Kevin says one of the I-beams has the
word "video" on it. That is not correct. It has something that
looks like VIDOE. I'm not sure where Kevin got that the Greek word
for freedom is on one of the beams. The Greek word for freedom is
ELEUTHERA, and I don't recall seeing that there.

Kevin is welcome to his opinion on my credibility. I retyped the
transcription to be "American" because Ray told me that his English
secretary had transcribed it from the tape and put it in English
vernacular. There was never any secrecy about this, and the main
thing I did was convert English spelling to American spelling. I'd
imagine that the original and my retyping are both out there
somewhere on the Internet for comparison.

This is the first I've heard that forensic specialists have said
that the muscles are those of a standing person rather than a body
at rest. What forensic specialists said that?

The place that Mike Hesemann and I went to outside Socorro is not
the place that Ed Gehrman has located. Mike and I did not follow
the road anywhere near as far as Ed did, and I was always skeptical
that Mike had located a crash site. We disagreed on that at the
time, and so far as I know, we still do.

I am intrigued and puzzled by the AA film. I don't know what it
depicts, but I am far from convinced that it shows a latex dummy
created by Ray Santilli and friends. I don't claim to understand
Ray's behavior about this odd artifact. But I do think we make a
big mistake if we simply dismiss it outright as a hoax. Once I am
in a position to do so, I plan to continue my investigation into
this mystery.

Sorry not to be able to go into more detail, but my memory is
imperfect and I do not have access to my notes and research

Bob Shell


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