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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 2012 > Sep > Sep 4

Re: Socorro Again

From: David Rudiak <drudiak.nul>
Date: Tue, 04 Sep 2012 14:20:30 -0700
Archived: Tue, 04 Sep 2012 17:39:15 -0400
Subject: Re: Socorro Again


>From: Viktor Golubic <Diverge247.nul>
>To: post.nul
>Date: Sun, 2 Sep 2012 16:59:43 -0400 (EDT)
>Subject: Re: Socorro Again

>>From: David Rudiak <drudiak.nul>
>>To: post.nul
>>Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2012 16:47:19 -0700
>>Subject: Re: Socorro Again

>>>From: Viktor Golubic <Diverge247.nul>
>>>To: post.nul
>>>Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2012 13:29:39 -0400 (EDT)
>>>Subject: Re: Socorro Again

>>>>From: Martin Shough <parcellular.nul>
>>>>To: <post.nul>
>>>>Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2012 13:09:19 +0100
>>>>Subject: Re: Socorro Again

><snip>

>>You can also look at other locations to see if the nearby
>>mountains had any obvious effect on the wind pattern. E.g.,
>>Alamogordo has very close and prominent mountains to the EAST,
>>and the same for Albuquerque (to the east and north). We would
>>expect these to generate an easterly component as the cooler
>>mountain air flowed down into the lowlands to the west. But this
>>is NOT evident from the recorded wind directions. Again, what we
>>see is the local winds being totally dominated by the large-
>>scale circulation of the low pressure system. Again, my multi-
>>state wind map, April 24, 1964:

I have since added to the above wind records, which now include
14 weather stations in New Mexico and 20 overall, N.M. and
nearby. New wind weather map:

http://www.roswellproof.com/Wind_map_NOAA_data_sm.jpg

The closest station I have found is Stallion Station Army Air
Field on the north edge of White Sands Missile Range, only 21
miles from the Socorro sighting. Winds were out of the south to
SSW in the hours from 5:00 to 7:00 p.m, bracketing the Socorro
sighting at about 5:50 p.m. The next two closest stations were
at Truth or Consequences (60 miles south) and Albuquerque (75
miles north), winds SSW to SW (T or C) and S to SSW (Alb.).
Judging by the recorded nearby winds and the general CCW
circulation pattern, I stated that the best guess wind direction
at the time in Socorro were probably out of the SSW.

Add to this Zamora said the blustery winds were out of the SSW
to SW at the time, Hynek likewise writing that his questioning
of various people (not just Zamora) indicated that the wind was
out of the south, or maybe the SW in another of his letters.

However, the winds needed to "blow" the Socorro object to the
WSW (according to four different landmarks named by Lonnie
Zamora including the very prominent nearby mine at the base of
the mountains and a canyon to the WSW) would have had to be out
of the ENE. No such weather station anywhere remotely near
Socorro had such winds, in fact one would have to go hundreds of
miles to the north to pick up such strong easterly winds in the
powerful, low pressure, counter-clockwise circulating air
pattern that was present at the time. The map says it all.

Now to Viktor's response to my email of 3 weeks ago.

>I missed your reply...

>Since no one had pointed out the effects of local topography, I
>felt is necessary to introduce this topic. What is interesting
>about Socorro is not only the proximity of the mountain but the
>valley directly west.

<snip>

>>This leaves the incredibly unlikely possibility that somehow the
>>wind practically reversed direction only in the Socorro area,
>>overcoming a large multi-state low pressure circulation pattern.
>>Please tell us where this incredible source of easterly winds
>>was supposed to come from Socorro if the mountains were actually
>>to the west?

>Downward circulating air from a mountain can spiral on a axis
>horizontal to the ground and backward. And this was why I paused
>to consider this as plausible.

>>Well so far all I see is that nothing fits. Just a lot of
>>handwaving conjecture and nothing of any substance anywhere.

>No, my point was that a proper analysis of the wind's behavior
>was not fully taken under consideration which I have added to
>recently.

Viktor, what you added to recently is here:

http://www.ufoupdateslist.com/2012/aug/m19-007.shtml

In which you wrote:

"Since there was no recorded wind data available in Socorro for
the day in question, publicly from the NWS or privately from the
NCDC, I proceeded to find days between early 2010 and late 2011
at the Socorro Municipal Airport that had regional surface
pressure patterns similar to those observed on the day in
question from the 4/24/1964 sighting."

<snip>

"Having completed some data analysis with similar pressure
surface patterns as was shown by David Rudiak on the day of
Lonnie's sighting, it does appear that a balloon could not have
been involved with the Socorro sighting, thus reducing the
probability on the UNM prank hypothesis considerably: The
proximity of the mountain range/valley does not appreciably
affect the counterclockwise wind pattern generated by the
regional surface pressure pattern NW of Socorro New Mexico
(Low), other than to channel them to a more pronounced Northerly
direction."

Or in other words, adding in data specifically from Socorro
doesn't really change anything given what we already knew from
existing wind records at the time. A hoax "balloon" can be ruled
out on this alone, plus other reported details, such as the
object disappearing at high speed in a STRAIGHT, HORIZONTAL,
unbobbing line just above ground level all the way to the
mountains. What real-world "balloon" can fly like this, even
ignoring the wind direction being totally wrong?


David Rudiak




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