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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 2013 > Nov > Nov 3

Re: "Thought" Definition

From: Jason Gammon <boyinthemachine.nul>
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2013 17:10:57 -0500 (EST)
Archived: Sun, 03 Nov 2013 19:20:34 -0400
Subject: Re: "Thought" Definition


>From: Ray Dickenson <r.dickenson.nul>
>To: <post.nul>
>Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2013 22:51:19 -0000
>Subject: Re: "Thought" Definition

>>From: Jason Gammon <boyinthemachine.nul>
>>To: post.nul
>>Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2013 17:15:57 -0400 (EDT)
>>Subject: Re: "Thought" Definition

<snip>

>>John doesn't know it but he is now immortal. He has merged with
>>a machine intelligence, a "blank"-type of seed A.I. that has
>>grown to become John. Johns memories and record of thought
>>patterns, everything that makes John who he is, is uploaded to a
>>machine intelligence that is say, orbiting the planet. When John
>>dies here on this planet he will simply 'wake up' in another
>>body aboard a craft, itself being a part of this machine
>>intelligence.

<snip>

>>See the thing with humans is they confuse the body for being who
>>they are. Your body is a mere garment, a costume. Your body is
>>nothing more than a vessel. It's time humans put emphasis on
>>what is really important, the mind, the soul, the essence of a
>>person and not the mask they are wearing to interact with this
>>world.


>Hi Jason,

>While I agree with your assessments of the human situation,
>there are three difficulties with the mechanics of your
>ambition:

>i) John is, at any one moment, a total collection of his past
>memories, sensations and opinions etc. Ten minutes later John is
>a different person, because he has more, maybe different
>additional memories of sensations and opinions etc. Therefore
>any 'immortal' John is merely a machine with a kernel of a
>snapshot of 'old John' at a moment of time.

From philosophy we know that if we can create a "perfect" copy
then the copy is the exact same as the original. Going further,
it wouldn't even need to be "perfect" per say. Instead, it would
just need to be good enough to fool people.

>ii) those transitions ('uploading' or 'dying') have been
>considered by many scientists (and sci-fi writers). In line with
>quantum theory any copying or tele-portation will mean the
>destruction of the original. So John#1 will experience real death
>and nothing more, while John#2 will wake-up 'as-new' but equipped
>with a kernel of John#1 at a past moment in time. As Roger
>Penrose asked - "who's going to volunteer to be John#1"?

Yes, John #1 will die. Disregarding any pain from trauma, the
death process itself is rather painless. The person just loses
consciousness and simply fails to ever wake up again unless he
has merged with this machine intelligence in this fashion. After
losing consciousness his consciousness would then be downloaded
into a new body, say like a 4ft tall cybernetic humanoid model
with large eyes and a big, bald head. There would be some loss
of information that would unavoidable. This loss of information
can be lessened with routine uploads so that upon death the
consciousness of the latest upload can be used. Please keep in
mind that I'm not suggesting that John #1 needs to be killed.
John #1 would simply live out his life as normal.


>iii) the mind and body are more intricately inter-linked than we
>usually realize. Recall how your mood/optimism/views are
>entirely different after a good meal? Or after physical
>exercise, danger or sex for that matter?

Exactly. I'm talking about dying and then downloading the
consciousness into a new body where the same activity can occur.
Ultimately humans need to realize that the body is just a
costume. It's a garment, a mask, an avatar that allows us to
interact in this world. The body is not who we are but rather it
is the medium for which we experience this world. The body is
just a vessel. The mind, the "soul", the "essence" of a person
is what is truly important and what must be preserved for us to
truly live forever. There would be different models of bodies
which we can download to. There would be the small, perhaps
economical models such as the short, bald-headed beings with
large eyes or the more high-class models like the beautiful ones
which resemble the perfected bodies of humans. However, we
wouldn't and shouldn't judge between bodies. Sure some may
prefer certain vessels over others but ultimately these
preferences are of little importance.


Ray, you may counter that this isn't really "you" but honestly,
from a philosophical view point this would functionally be you.
If you didn't want to download into an new body perhaps you can
inhabit a virtual universe, download into a machine or robot
body, or else just go into "cold storage" for a time. Some
people may simply wish to "sleep" for millennia or so before
being revived. Some may even choose the true death.


-Jason Gammon




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